Bill Cosby's Remarks About the African American Youth

talk
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@brook
I think you know what I mean. I layed it out very pretty for you. So I cannot address it anymore than I have. If you are there and or have been there. Then you know the value of my statement. To argue it just lets me know that you are either detached or never been there.

@BL
It was no secret my coach informed me he was alotted an extra scholarship due to AA. And guess who got it…:slight_smile: But that was not going to deter my college hopes as I was heavily recruited but alot rides on which school you graduate from. I know it sounds weird and unfair but because of the time at which I took my SAT’s and an injury some major colleges took me off their radars.

49

That is my point exactly. Impact. If you really want to change get down there at ground zero and do so. Dont think you can do so from a CNN couch. WHile his success is a inspiration in itself. If you are from there you know it takes more than that.

50

understood. i do see now that i probably came off a little nieve. really all i was trying to get across is that although affirmative action has its good points, it also has its bad.

its kind of incredible how quickly human interaction can get so far off the beaten path.

51

@DDD
your still way off I am nether detached and I HAVE been there. Read the name its brooklyn…lol That whole last statement you made is a hasty generalization in the least. To you its either this or that…

You guys are so caught up with believeing that the “best” way is trying to touch individuals that you fail to see that there “is more than one way to skin a cat”

There is more than one way to help the community. Community centers are not the only way to help the community. Not only that but the whole “detached” argument is weak. Hes detached so he cant relate anymore. Please. Thats a cop-out used to discredit someone who has been there. The fact that he isnt there anymore should make him more of an authority and should give more weight to his point. When your in a situation your view of whats going on is much smaller than when you are out of it and you can look back on the situation objectively. Basically your “world view” is larger after you get out the ghetto and experience more of the world. Think people. Think. So the Cosby is “detached” arguement is weak at best and actually discredits your whole point.

The fact is that he made a true statement. People need to learn the language, people need to be parents… think you have to start somewhere …and isnt acknowlegement of the problem the first step? But like I said to many people that hate its never enough. One man risking being critisized to bring these issues to light and start debate is not enough and he cant get respected for even taking that first step. People would rather hate on the man then appreciate what he started, take the ball and run with it for the benefit of the people. Please give me a break. (like the late N. Carter…lol)

_ONE

52

Like I said I agree with you and yes he did make a true statement. I just dont see how pointing a finger and saying this social group has a problem and I am rich so listen to me is going to help. It’s not like he was talking to a government official about it. He was talking to a news anchorman. You call it taking a step, but everyone and the momma already knows there is issues in the ghetto and education is one of them. So he is taking a step many people have already taken hell Bill Clinton our ex-President took that same step and look the problem is still there. So no my friend I dont commend him for taking this step. I do commend him for being a role model and inspiration. BUt like I said unfortunately there is baggage that comes with that whether you like it or not. And not many respond to that. Explain to me how Bill getting on TV and saying what has been said forever going to help this social-economic issue? Did he bring a new solution? Hell did he find a new problem?

But I did hear on the news that he now intends to setup some scholarships and send some kids to college. I did not catch the full report because I was walking out the door. But it seems like he might have seen this post…lol. Final note there is more than one way to skin a cat, but you actually have to skin the cat at one point, not talk about the different ways (to borrow your phrase).

53

The fact the people are talking about the issues he brought up IS a step. People are just too blinded by fear and shame to be smart about the comments and use it uplift themselves.

Funny thing is that Bill and his wife have been multimillion dollar contributers to Spelman & Morehouse Colleges(two of the largest oldest historically black colleges in the USA) for years. If you have been to Spelman College then you should know he funded the million dollar Camille Cosby building and has provided funds for scholarships for many years. I know because I used to date someone that went to Spelman and I been there many times. But oh funding educations, and supporting institutions that directly help his people is not really doing anything huh? …lol Pull your head out the sand & get your facts straight before you make up your mind about an issue and pass judgement about someone and what they do. Thats the wise thing to do.

54

Let me re-itereate. I agree with you on several of your points just not all of them.

All of the scholarships and buildings were after his son died. Before which his support was non-existant. And those scholarships are mainly for persons who are already attending Spellman unless that has changed recently. Which albeit is still a good thing. And the building you speak of the Camille center was kinda donated to him you could say. His name was endorsed on it. I used to hang out up at Spellman so I too have been there. My hand has never been in the sand. I know first hand what interaction with the youth can do. And since I am living my words I feel that gives my opinion validity. You on the other hand is speculating about the effectiveness of a method. You have not reaped the benefits of MJ’s theater. You have not attended a class at Spellman. You have not received a Bill Cosby scholarship. Nor can you name a person you know personally that has benefitted from anything you have mentioned. From the sounds of things you have not even lent a helping hand to anyone. So you should have your facts straight before you comment. I personally am trying to make a change you are discussing change. I have made a positive impact in my community lets not forget that. I just really feel Bill should interact more with the community and maybe more folks will realize the real needs of the ghetto.

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LOL you speak of what you dont know homie slow ya roll. I dont need to prove my point by telling you about myself and personal accolades. If I wanted to prove you wrong and make my point based on MY experiences and not my point and the facts then I could have blown you out in my first post but Im not a show off and thats not my intention. But since you insist smarty pants I went to Morehouse I have an undergrad DEGREE from there, I also atteneded other schools and went to school overseas also… you dont know me. I attended Spelman college I took classes over there (I cross registered.) I can name many people who were able to take classes and directly benefitted from his contributiuon to the school. His son went to my school an yes Bill Cosby was contributing long before Innis(his son) was murdered. Get ya facts straight.

You cant win an arguement based on the topic so you want to talk about me and even there your off. Slow ya roll you did nothing in this thread but prove that you dont know JACK.

holla at purdue.

_ONE

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lol…mr. ebonics all of a sudden…lol…My bad for the assumption but you went from dating someone at Spellman to going there and receiveing an Undergrad degree. Okay… Well like I said I walk the walk and have already made an impact. So i know what works. And like I said, giving back to the community you came from can have a greater more resounding immediate effect than a indirect approach. That is the whole basis of my point. The problems in the ghetto is not funding for college. Which if you ask around not many will know that program exists and if they cannot read in HS how are they going to get to that scholarship? This conversation as reached its end. But sit back and think about what you said and one day it will jump up and kick ya in the butt and then you will realize what I was talking about.

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You know I saw a comic on Tough Crowd(Patrice Oneal) say something that was really disheartening, and its been on my mind since the night I heard it. He said that in the community he grew up in(and he categorized all black communities in this manner) the kids who tried to step up and become smart were then classified as white, as to discourage the individual who wanted to get a good education, not to emulate a race. Its sad, but its a different view that I had never seen.

As for my experiences, growing up in a 65% black school, it seemed that too many of the kids didn’t get the type of early childhood reinforcement to stress the importance of a good education and all of the opportunities that having one affords you. I see it reflected later in life now that I’m in my early 20s too at jobs. In some people you can see a lack of work ethic to go out and get what you want, because it isn’t out of your reach. I don’t think some people have heard that. I have worked with some great people who are African American, and I am currently trying to get a design job with a guy who was on Black Entrepenuers top 100 black businessmen of 2003, so there are some people who understand what is in front of them. I definitely don’t think its because of a lack of opportunity, just a lack of drive instilled within the youth. Hell, I didn’t have any drive going to college, so a 3.9gpa student had to learn the hard way more than once about work ethic(being asked to leave a college sucks, lets put it that way).

-Sentientv2

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The Cos (sorry, I love referring to him as that) wasn’t merely ranting about the tendency of black youths to use improper spoken English.

If anything he was commenting on the fact that poor linguistic skills are a part of a larger “us vs. them” mentality. The mentality that speaking “proper English” is succumbing to the white man’s ways. The mentality that holding on to a job and working hard for what you get is succumbing to the white man’s ways. In its attempt to alienate and seperate itself from the nebulously categorical “white man,” an identifiable segment of the equally nebulously categorical “black community” has consciously avoided doing anything that could truly lead them to better, happier lives.

Then again, the Cos is far-removed from the very community he’s so quick to judge. He’s rich and he’s spewing comments across a very big generation gap. It’s to be expected of course. Very often the oldest generation forgets just how much more racist, sexist, and violent their time was. And choosing to instead criticize and get “all flezzle in the bezzle” at an entire generation they know little or nothing about.

59

Sorry Im just now re-stumbling back on this but the funny thing is that the very reason that hes removed and “rich” is the very reason he should be listened to.

Name me one person in the ghetto that does not want to be in Cosbys shoes? Ok.So we all know people want to get out of the ghetto. Cosby grew up poor in Philly with no father around, so its not like he was a rich priviliged kid all his life. You people should know the back groung about what you speak before you type.
A person who got out of the ghetto and made it like he did is the best type of person to tell those still there what to do to get out.
A person that grew up from a broken home is the best person to talk about the effects of a broken home. People in the ghetto dont know how to get out so it takes someone like Cosby who WAS there and got out to teach. People need to stop being so defensive, take a look in the mirrior and take heed. POINT BLANK

_ONE

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Sorry Im just now re-stumbling back on this but the funny thing is that the very reason that hes removed and “rich” is the very reason he should be listened to.

Not really, but then that comes down to a matter of ideals and morals. I believe it would be more advantagious to make the path easier for others. If I found my way thru a snowstorm yet covered my track as I went. It would help no one to tell them just go straight…you feel me.

Name me one person in the ghetto that does not want to be in Cosbys shoes? Ok.

Me I dont want to be in his shoes. I mean I would not mind having endless money flow. But I dont want the hassles of being famous.

So we all know people want to get out of the ghetto. Cosby grew up poor in Philly with no father around, so its not like he was a rich priviliged kid all his life. You people should know the back groung about what you speak before you type.

I am well aware of his background. I think everyone is. And it is an inspiring story. But it is almost like that untouchable myth, that is just what it is. Inspiration. But when you come back down and give back, help, mentor anything to your neighborhood. You make that dream/myth tangible. Which renews hope, faith and determination. I have seen this first hand so many times. And also was a product of that same caring. A allstar athlete took me under his wing and mentored me and a few others and it meant the world.

A person who got out of the ghetto and made it like he did is the best type of person to tell those still there what to do to get out.

Ah ha…my point exactly. but it also depends on where you are speaking from. Speaking from the cnn couch is not the same as speaking from a inner city school auditorium. Or a boys and girls club. I think slowly but surely you are seeing it my way. Especially where your statements are heading.

A person that grew up from a broken home is the best person to talk about the effects of a broken home. People in the ghetto dont know how to get out so it takes someone like Cosby who WAS there and got out to teach. People need to stop being so defensive, take a look in the mirrior and take heed. POINT BLANK.

True to a sense. we/they all know how to get out of the ghetto. It is really how to get the ghetto out of us is what needs to be taught. Ask any street thug, crack head or normal inner city dweller how to get out of the ghetto. You will here, stay in school, get an education, stay out of jail, stay off drugs…The normal after school special stuff. So they all know, it is not a secret how to get out. But it is almost like being a prisoner of your habitat. it becomes you and all you know and come to love. I mean I loved my broken up and cracked streetball court and all the people in my neighborhood. But to be shown and have it demonstrated in a tangible fashion the fruits of the labor of a person who “made it” is way different than making commercials and cnn guest appearances. Believe me.

I am not totally poking holes in Bill, but I just think for him to get up there and make the strong statements he did. He can be doing more. I can name alot of athletes and stars who are doing alot more for inner city communities than talk. And I would respect these comment a little more coming from them.

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But to be shown and have it demonstrated in a tangible fashion the fruits of the labor of a person who “made it” is way different than making commercials and cnn guest appearances. Believe me.

Thats just your opinnion, Thats YOUR perception of what giving back is. Many do not see it that way. Many, Many people are not affected that way …but the fact of the matter is that to some seeing someone on the couch of David letterman is more motivation than seeing someone that “made it” back in the “old” neighborhood. For example… seeing an emcee like Jay-Z at the MTV awards on TV when you know they grew up on your block can be more of a motivation to do for self and get out of the hood than seeing him come back to the projects to give gifts. Actually being on TV can be the “Fruits of labor.” If I write a bestseller then getting on Oprah can very well be the fruits of my labor…

LOL I dont see it your way.

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I do realize that is my opinion as that is only what I can speak to. but by the response I and a friend have been getting from our midnight league basketball stops. And our mini camps. I would lean a little more towards my solution as it is much more than a single opnion. During the summer I deal with 1000’s of teens and several celebrities between midnight leagues, promotions and mini camps. So I see a broader scope of the impact. Where as you may only see your opinion and a few colleagues. So my opinion is indeed not a hollow representation of only what I see. I actually see 100’s of kids faces light up to see Jason Kidd come in and speak. i actually see these kids go from failing grades to straight A’s so they can come back and play in our tournaments. So my friend yes Bill can be doing more. But you are right. Anything is more than nothing.

You see the good thing about a discussion such as this is too think outside of your own view. When you say you dont see it my way lets me know you aint trying to. Rather than trying to disprove mine, prove yours as being viable. Talk about how you or others have benefitted. You provide nothing more than opinion. And a shaky one at that. But I do appreciate the conversation.

63

Just a quick update on the Cosby thing: http://entertainment.msn.com/tv/article.aspx?news=165551

I like this quote from here:

Instead of joining the Peace Corps and going to Africa, “go across the street into the projects. These are people who need to see another picture, a brighter picture,” he said.

:rambo:

64

That is exactly what I am saying. It starts with the place of most influence for the individual.

On the other hand I hate when people blame rap music for anything. It is just another form of expression, art and entertainmaent. Story telling if you will. Thats like saying Hollywood glorifies killing andmurder sprees with their movies. Just plain ridiculous. Rap music does not make anyone do anything. At least not more than TV does. But thats another debate.

65

I agree with your opinnion on music but that is another story and Kirupa with all due respect you did not say what you liked about that quote…this IS a discussion :stuck_out_tongue:

but back to what DDD said… it funny that you (DDD) try to quantify the amount of people you reach and compare that to Bill Cosby when for all intensive purposes you could not begin to compare to what that man has done in terms of people that he has motivated through not only his TV show’s (Cosby Show, Fat Albert, the new kids cartoon shows he has…the name escapes me, speeches at universitys etc.) to you that means nothing, but the fact of the matter is that Cosby being a public figure in the spotlight through his success, preaching wholesome values in apositve manner has probly reached more people than you ever will.

Maybe you should read or reread W.E.B. Dubois, or some other harlem renaissance writers who spoke on the impact of showing the positive black people, and the need for it. These are the things that are inevitably necessary to shift public opinnion away from streotypes about black people (as ignorant as they may be) in terms of not being good citizens that would help to end things like racial profiling etc. Not only that but these positve images also provide many young black kids with a positive rolemodels and the positve imagery does more subconciously for all americans than you choose to accept.

My point is that, yes what you do with your youth groups in the hundreds is commendable I never said it wasnt but you should not discredit somone elses approach that is just as effective in another manner if not more effective which it probly is. His world view is obviously larger than yours in that he is looking at changing the image of black people on a global level through presenting positive images of the people.

_ONE

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In all actuality I am not comparing to Bill where as I am solidifying my opinion. So I guess you can say I am comparing to you and your opinion. Where the difference is I am living it and you are talking and reading about it. I guess that is why our opinions will never meet. But in the purpose of open discussion I would say my opinion is based on a stronger foundation. Basedon the fact that Bill hisself seems to back up my opinion in the link that Kirupa posted and like I said I see the impact first hand through my extra-curricular activities. So I guess this is a case of perception against reality. I choose reality.

Never said his method was not effective. I just said he could be more effective with a different approach. And not be so detached. Never doubted his icon status.

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lol … your whole argument is weak at best. Sub-Par.

Where the difference is I am living it and you are talking and reading about it. I guess that is why our opinions will never meet.

Instead of getting at the issues you try to attack me again. (I already proved you DO NOT KNOW ME) You have no idea about “what I am living”. lol

See, to me you are just a crab, another crab in the bucket (aka hater) keeping people down by choosing to attack someone who has good intentions and IS doing something to help his people. Why dont you use that same energy you are using to attack Bill for something else, like to attack someone who is NOT helping anyone or someone who is hurting the commmunity.