i have been reading alot of religion discussions that were going on n the ordered forum. and i might say they are very interesting…
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arrite sorry about that but ill rephrase it what do you think makes a good leader…now y’all can answer that cant you
if u can answer…who do u think iin ur opinion is the greatest leader
No man (person) is greater than any other man (person).
There is no “one” greatest person on the planet.
Except maybe Kirupa :trout:
One person…no idea. I have too many people that I like who would be good in one category but bad in another! :beard:
sorry peeps i just edited my post
Now when you ask great leader do you mean does good things, or great leader gets people to follw them well?
[U]Great Leaders for good causes[/U]
Jesus Christ
Gahndi (sp?)
Mandela
Ben Franklin
Abe Lincoln
Dwight D. Ehisenhower (sp?)
Winston Churchill
Ronald Regan
George W Bush
[U]Good Leaders bad causes[/U]
Adolph Hitler
Julius Ceasar
Osama Ben Laden
Napolean
There are plenty of people who are/were good leaders but just lost sight of their goals (going mad with power, insanity, and so on):
Afterall, one man’s terrorist is another man’s freedom fighter.
Abe Lincoln, Ronald Regen, Mandela
'Splain
Lincoln lead a nation sucessfully through a war that most did not want but that was right to keep our nation in tact.
Reagan went head to head with the only other world power and sucessfully toppled them without firing a shot. He with the might of the US and all other free nations outspent an enemy into colapse. Also he won 49 out of 50 states in re-election, that to me is a learder with people behind him
Ah, yes, great leaders but… meh…
I’ll leave it at that, as I really don’t think it’s worth it to needlessly piss on your parade.
Although, as an aside, I’m surprised you didn’t include FDR on your list.
does it seem like I’m bullying you BL if I rant about your good leaders? 
(cause Reagan came in what, 1980? The worst was already over, Vietnam did a lot to ruin Russian morale).
True, Mandela was jailed for life for terrorist attacks including sabotage to power plants. Although he was fighting apartheid against the ruling white goverment he was guilty of blowing up several power stations and narrowly avoided the death sentence over those crimes. Fast forward 30 years and he’s released to a hero’s welcome and as quick as they can they elect him President…hmm, go figure.
Why was julius caesar a good leader who had a bad cause?
He, like others, wanted to spread his kingdom (as it was cause he wasn’t king he was an elected ruler) and as a result the Roman empire covered almost 7/10’s of the known world then. Some of it by his hand, some before he got the job. He bullied his enemies into submission both in the goverment and on the battlefield and the Roman empire flourished as a result. Bad for everyone else, but good if you were Roman. But as the saying goes “What have the romans ever done for us?”
FDR used pis$ poor judgement creating the New Deal wich lead to a prolonged the Great Depression. Only WWII got the US out, when it could have ended far sooner.
RabBell,
Bad people have done good things, but those good things don’t necessarily make them a good person. Ceasar lead like and was a tyrant. Under Hitlers Germany jet aircraft were invented, that good thing did not make hilter less of an evil.
EDIT***
Am I the only one going to give suggestions? Are we just going to argue about what I think instead of others giving other (better) suggestions?
I’m the greatest leader. You’ll bow into submission when I rule over the world!!
Come Pinky we have a lot to do tonight…
:lol: what we doing tonight brain 
No I agree with you that good things don’t make bad people less evil what I meant was I don’t see how Caesar was evil. He went across europe with his army, killing millions on the way but this surely makes him a conqueror (sp?) doesn’t it?
And point taken about everyone arguing about your selections, my pick would have to be James T. Kirk - What a guy 
Seriously though I’d say that every leader has problems. Bad points, they’re not all perfect. Even Churchhill was voted out of office a year after the war was over. Gandhi went on hunger strikes if he didn’t win elections. I guess it’s up to personal choice about what type of leader gets your respect, who led men the best and who changed the world. I would say Napolean led his men best, got the best results however you have to look at his motives. Much like Caesars and Alexanders it was all personal.
So I’ll go for Muhammed Ali.
A man who earned respect…yes
A man who can rightly be called legend…yes
A leader…in a way, yes
Everyone looks up to Ali. What a mere boxer accomplished. He became bigger than boxing, a spokesman for black people the world over. An entertainer and legend. He helped break down some of those cultural divides between the white and black people. Most people were scared of the muslim’s in the 60’s, they thought they were a cult. He helped (didn’t do it alone, he helped) break down stereotypes and showed the world that it’s a peaceful loving religion and not a mind altering cult. He was larger than life, a leader…you bet.
That’s why my pick is Muhammed Ali, the greatest :thumb:
So I’ll go for Muhammed Ali.
A man who earned respect…yes
A man who can rightly be called legend…yes
A leader…in a way, yes
Everyone looks up to Ali. What a mere boxer accomplished. He became bigger than boxing, a spokesman for black people the world over. An entertainer and legend. He helped break down some of those cultural divides between the white and black people. Most people were scared of the muslim’s in the 60’s, they thought they were a cult. He helped (didn’t do it alone, he helped) break down stereotypes and showed the world that it’s a peaceful loving religion and not a mind altering cult. He was larger than life, a leader…you bet.
That’s why my pick is Muhammed Ali, the greatest :thumb:
answers like these ^ is what i am looking for
in theorie i totally agree with the above posts about the ideal that no man should stand above another.
in real life, i, as well as certainly we all have been in so many situations where people at least for a moment did not know how to handle a certain situation and looked for someone to give them directions… so out of that experience i’m convinced that the perfect leader is the one (or the group/team) that can solve the problem at hand. Since the complexity of our world forces people to specialize, every problem needs a different person/group to handle it. so for me, perfect leadership would be, if the people empower those capable of improving a situation just for the time it takes.
i’d appreciate that much more than electing a guy who merely advertises to be “the right one for the job”…
Reagan went head to head with the only other world power and sucessfully toppled them without firing a shot. He with the might of the US and all other free nations outspent an enemy into colapse. Also he won 49 out of 50 states in re-election, that to me is a learder with people behind him
I agree on everything, except the “without firing a shot” while he personaly did not fire a shot, the Mujhadeen in Afghanistan did, they did alot of shot firing, they where a huge part of the colapse. (Aided by the US ofcourse)
FDR used pis$ poor judgement creating the New Deal wich lead to a prolonged the Great Depression. Only WWII got the US out, when it could have ended far sooner.
Dude, are you still on that Libraterian assumption article? And they just hate it because its a Social programs.
I disagree with you completly. While Ronal Raegan won the war against the Strongest Soviet country, FDR saved america from Communism, at no time was America more at risk to become Communist than during the Depression, and he played unique role in keeping the country politically stable during its greatest economic crisis. Rooselvelt was able to undercut all the Far-left parties and relieve them from any voice, even though the parties steadely grew during the great Depression FDR was able to destroy all those parties. And thats just a small part, he began all the foundation for post-war foreign policy, esspecialy with the emergence of the soviet union. And during and before the War, only three other men understood what Hitler was about; Winston Churchill, Stalin and Mousolini. And the way he was able to transform America, from 27th military in the world to the first in his presendency is a pretty worthy acheivment, what he did, like no one else, Created modern America. And even if you didn’t like the New Deal Program, its like one step back and ten steps forward.
Ok, so RB like FDR. YOu could have just said that 
Yeah I know…
I like to make speeches 
ahem…could we type out full names whenever myself and Russian has posted in a thread, kinda confused me for a while there 
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