What about... cannabis?

61

until they can figure out a way to test you to see if you high while driving…it won’t be legal…

There are methods for testing this. When a police officer holds a pen in front of your face, and asks you to follow it with your eyes and not your head, he is checking to see if you are under the influence of marijuana… He is looking for eye drift, because when high, your body is so relaxed that one of your eyes will begin to drift out of focus when looking at the pen… I dont know how to beat that one, but on a related note: if a police officer has you stand on one leg, and touch your nose, or uses any other sobriety test involving balance, it really helps you appear less intoxicated than you really are if you keep one knee slightly bent. :slight_smile:

NOTE: I do not condone drinking and driving, but i also do not recommend getting a DUI. :trout:

62

Yeah, but those tests are not concrete, and I am sure there are stoners many stoners that can pull it off…

(btw, I condone drinking and driving!)

63

you should try it with your friends… its quite interesting… Do it with some that are sober, and then with some that are baked…

in case you’ve never been through it, hold a pen in front of someones face, and have them focus on the tip. Instruct them to follow it with their eyes, and not their head. move it to the side, and then back to the other side, pausing at the sides, and watch for ‘eye drift’ or twitching. The thing to look for, is the eye losing focus and looking ‘past’ the pen tip. :eye Ive heard that there are ways of combating this, but for the most part, its the most effective field sobriety test for a cop to do without going to the trunk, and getting the blood sampling kit… ::eek::

UPDATE: After some experimenting, my friend and i determined that the giveaway is in the eyes inability to focus on the the pencil and not past the pencil…

64

I have personally passed that test (when I shouldn’t have)… however, I naturally have a muscular problem with my eyes, so that may actually help in that test…

CHP is famous for that test…

Rev

65

The main reason that I think Cannabis should <b>not</b> be legalized is because of the lack of reality it gives you. Cannabis may be a great thing indeed, but it makes you do goofy stuff. Let’s say you roll a huge fatty before driving off to work one day right? And a little girl just so happens to be crossing the street, and you cannot react fast enough to stop for her and you end up hitting her.

Now if Cannabis could somehow be limited to using in your own home or someone elses, then there would not be a problem.

Cya :pope:

66

The main reason that I think Cannabis should not be legalized is because of the lack of reality it gives you. Cannabis may be a great thing indeed, but it makes you do goofy stuff. Let’s say you roll a huge fatty before driving off to work one day right? And a little girl just so happens to be crossing the street, and you cannot react fast enough to stop for her and you end up hitting her.

Now if Cannabis could somehow be limited to using in your own home or someone elses, then there would not be a problem.

Read the arguments here and you will find that most advocate using marijuana responsibly. Your scenario involving the little girl could also apply to alcohol, cell phones, and/or stupidity. Bad drivers are bad drivers. Blaming marijuana is a cop-out on the obvious fact: that person is irresponsible for driving under the influence of a substace that impairs their ability to drive.

Many countries allow marijuana use, and they don’t have anything close to the amount of drug and alchohol problems as are found in the US. The war on dope is a way to keep the jails filled, and the prices for street drugs high. Costly street drugs serve two purposes: They keep most of the users in poverty, and they line the pockets of those criminal organizations (namely the CIA) which supply most of americas illicit drugs…

67

Just read through the whole thread, one of my favorite topics, so I got to bust a little bit :

A correction for Majeye on the eye-test: as a recent DUI myself, part of the sentence in Arizona includes 16 hours of “rehab”/counseling. They make you watch a bunch of videos, the counselors tell you how they used to smoke crack and eat babies until they found Jesus, and they draw a lot of diagrams like “the timeline of Addiction” and “the flowchart of Alcoholism”, also the always-popular “web diagram of DOOM”.

The cool thing was that they explained the whole eye-test deal- you know how when you’re really drunk, you get the bedspins? Ever had time to really evaluate the mechanics of said phenomenon? Well, I can say (unfortunately) there’s been many a time I’ve laid there after a hard night out, wishing my vision would stop oscillating so I could get to sleep, and you realize that if you attempt to focus on something, your eyes drift away and snap back. That’s what the eye test is for, if you’ve had a certain amount to drink, you can’t keep your eyes on the pencil when it comes close to your peripheral vision- your eyes twitch. They showed us a video, it’s pretty cool. “Susan Straightedge at a BAC of .00, tracking the pencil. Notice how she is able to focus on the pencil all the way to the corners of her eyes”
“Dave Drunkard at a BAC of .015, notice how he can’t seem to get his d@mn act together and look at the pencil without twitching like a mental patient.”

On my good friend The Kind, a couple things to think about:
1.) When I was 20, I blazed up all day long, every day, until I went to sleep, and accomplished little in life beyond becoming very good at certain Playstation games, passably proficient at joint rolling, and a master of the barbecue and its associated rituals.
2.) Some time later I realized my working vocabulary had decreased by approximately 20%, which scared me.
3.) I started reading frequently again a few years ago, and surprise surprise, my vocab’s back in full effect!

Which leads me to believe 2 things,
a. Even if I’d never come under the sway of the Green Menace, I still wouldn’t have done sh!t for myself when I was 20, I was simply a lazy little b@stard, weed or not.
b. What’s up with the supposed brain damage? Seems to me the only damage I incurred was a result of sitting around, playing video games and eating corn on the cob all d@mn day, instead of exercising my brain.

I still smoke a little herb on occasion, pretty much only on weekends or when I don’t have a lot else to do (read:almost never), as I’ve noticed that pot kills my productivity, dead, for a good 6 hours, and hampers it noticeably for a good 12 hours after that. Can’t afford to be non-productive anymore, you can only be a lazy bum for so long.

I look forward to saving up enough loot to travel the world and get high on far-flung beaches, drinking unfamiliar beer and eating coconut-milk based seafood dishes. But until then, who has time to smoke pot in any kind of a dedicated fashion? Not I, said the fly.

Anyways, I guess that was a little long-winded and introspective, probably semi-irrelevant and self-indulgent as well. That’s what happens when you smoke weed :bandit:

-Corey

68

The war on dope is a way to keep the jails filled, and the prices for street drugs high. Costly street drugs serve two purposes: They keep most of the users in poverty, and they line the pockets of those criminal organizations (namely the CIA) which supply most of americas illicit drugs…

RIGHT ON !

http://www.fromthewilderness.com/store/videos.html#911

69

well the seatbelt thing seems to me to be a bit trivial … such an easy thing to do yet it saves sooooooo many lives … so what if theres a law about it … you should wear it anyway …

oh, and in keeping with the topic … yes i believe cannabis is good and should be legalised. In london (where im from) they have been for a while considerind declassifying cannabic from a class B drug to a class C - ie instrad of being with speed and acid, its in the same category as tranquilisers and shrooms … (coke and heroin etc … are class A). also in certain areas of london like brixton it is known that police overlook users and small-time dealers …

70

On my good friend The Kind, a couple things to think about:
1.) When I was 20, I blazed up all day long, every day, until I went to sleep, and accomplished little in life beyond becoming very good at certain Playstation games, passably proficient at joint rolling, and a master of the barbecue and its associated rituals.
2.) Some time later I realized my working vocabulary had decreased by approximately 20%, which scared me.
3.) I started reading frequently again a few years ago, and surprise surprise, my vocab’s back in full effect!

just something to add here.

  1. me too. Smoked up all the time.
  2. and 3) Unlike you, I learned to enjoy reading while I was stoned. I actually did almost no reading in my life before I got high. But the exact opposite happened to me. My vocabulary increased dramaticaly (spelling still sucks though.:slight_smile: ). This only proves what you say all the more. Your vocabulary decrease was probebly entirely due to a lack of motivation to read, rather than any damage occuring to you.

I’ll agree with you about motivation. It kills most of it. However, if you can find something that you enjoy doing, it increases motivation, and concentration on that subject matter. Hence, vid game skillz. My own aquired with dope skillz include QuakeIII, Web design, and Flash programing.

I think it all depends on the person, and their personal motivations. It certainly makes you not care about things that you are not motivated already to perform.

71

reality is 4 ppl who can’t handle drugs…

ahem…

allegedly

=o)

72

i dont see why alchohol is legal and pot isn’t. there isn’t anything wrong with smoking it. i mean how come when little johnny turns 18 his dad gives him a beer at the dinner table. whats the difference if he gave him a joint. as far as the legal aspect, again. alchohol is just as dangerous if not more then maryjuana.

i am in no way supporting pot smoke, just pointing out the facts

73

The reason alchohol is legal, and marijuana is not is pretty simple: Alchohol is a drug that does not inspire creativity. It is an escape from reality, like most drugs, but is not a ‘consciousness expanding drug’. Drink all you want, and the only thing you develop is cirrosis, and maybe a higher drinking tolerance, not to mention a costly bar-tab.

Marijuana on the other hand, has the potential to alter the user, and most often in a good way. Like all drugs, it has the potential to be abused, but used responsibly, it can really change your perception of reality, for the better. Who’s more likely to start a fight with a stranger, a person under the influence of pot, or a person who has been drinking? The fact is, alchohol grows everywhere, serves a thousand different purposes (all of them positive), and its existance and acceptance would probably bankrupt a lot of americas pharmaceutical giants, who cash in on a ‘sick’ america.

Basically, they’d rather sell you something that does nothing for you, and causes depression, than let you have something that will open your eyes…

74

dude, that was perfect… your so right when you say

Who’s more likely to start a fight with a stranger, a person under the influence of pot, or a person who has been drinking?

but do you see my point about parents “allowing” their kids to drink because society says it’s ok. i think drinking is much worse for your bodily damage. in fact… i could name at least 5 friends I had that are no longer here becasue of alcholol. can’t name 1 because of maryjuana…

75

a lot of what i said was paraphrased from a comedian named Bill Hicks. He was extremely brilliant, and probably would have been considered more of a social commentator if he wasn’t so ****ed funny… If you’ve ever heard Tool’s Aenima album, then you’ve already heard a couple of his bits…

look into him, i know you’ll resonate with what he says…

and yes, i totally agree; the hypocracy of allowing alcohol while condemning all other drugs is baffling to me… i am proud to say that i havn’t drank alcohol since last november…

76

*Originally posted by upuaut *
**just something to add here.

  1. me too. Smoked up all the time.
  2. and 3) Unlike you, I learned to enjoy reading while I was stoned. I actually did almost no reading in my life before I got high. But the exact opposite happened to me. My vocabulary increased dramaticaly (spelling still sucks though.:slight_smile: ). This only proves what you say all the more. Your vocabulary decrease was probebly entirely due to a lack of motivation to read, rather than any damage occuring to you.

I’ll agree with you about motivation. It kills most of it. However, if you can find something that you enjoy doing, it increases motivation, and concentration on that subject matter. Hence, vid game skillz. My own aquired with dope skillz include QuakeIII, Web design, and Flash programing.

I think it all depends on the person, and their personal motivations. It certainly makes you not care about things that you are not motivated already to perform. **

my addition:

  1. still do
  2. I learned to truly enjoy several things because I was stoned. literature, history, biology, music theory, etc. If you allow anyone to sit and veg, stoned or not, chances are they will. Who is to say, that if not stoned, you would have gotten up and been doing something (a lot of non-stoned people spend their early 20’s playing PS2)? I have made it a point to get up and become active when I get stoned, so it is now difficult for me to sit still, or veg on the couch.

My short term memory while stoned can be quite full of holes, but it returns when sober.

I am sloppy, stupid, and can’t speak properly when drunk, where I am goofy, funny, and animated when stoned.

I am a much safer driver while <i>mildly</i> high, I drive slower, give lots of room, etc. I also experience very little road rage. I agree that you never see fist fights between stoned men. I’ve seen arguments, but fairly quickly someone gives in, or they forget what they were arguing about…

I never had massive vid game skills, so I can’t give any insight there.

I also live in SF, where it is <i>almost</i> legal, where you can smoke a j walking down the street, and not worry about getting busted… a friend of mine actually lit up on the City Hall steps the other day, just to see what would happen…

nothing did…

Rev

77

I am a much safer driver while mildly high, I drive slower, give lots of room, etc. I also experience very little road rage. I agree that you never see fist fights between stoned men. I’ve seen arguments, but fairly quickly someone gives in, or they forget what they were arguing about…

hahahahhahahahahahahahahhahahhaahaa. that is so true.

78

lmao tru dat rev :slight_smile: nothin like sitting down writing some as while stoned sour :slight_smile:

79

*Originally posted by reverendflash *
**my addition:

  1. still do
  2. I learned to truly enjoy several things because I was stoned. literature, history, biology, music theory, etc. If you allow anyone to sit and veg, stoned or not, chances are they will. Who is to say, that if not stoned, you would have gotten up and been doing something (a lot of non-stoned people spend their early 20’s playing PS2)? I have made it a point to get up and become active when I get stoned, so it is now difficult for me to sit still, or veg on the couch.

That’s cool man. I used to have the exact same attitude, and hold up your end of the exact same conversation with people, and I’ve only modified my views slightly since then.
I guess the difference is what you’re measuring yourself against- i.e. “I am more motivated and active than your average daily pot smoker, I don’t just sit around and veg out on the couch” vs. “I am as motivated and active as it is theoretically possible for me to be.” I think we can agree that it is not possible to reach 100% of your maximum productivity level while smoking pot all day, like it or not.

That may not be what you’re shooting for right now, however. Not everyone needs to function at 100% all the time to acheive their goals. If owning my own business is the most important thing to me, for example, I know that for the first couple years I need to be spending every waking minute focusing on ways to improve my business, until I build up a client base and get things running smoothly. Now if I’m in the “running smoothly” stage, everything’s going well, and I can afford to sit back and relax a little, I’m probably going to spark a J pretty frequently. Likewise, if I’m working a 9-to-5 that I’m satisfied with, and I’m happy with where I am, I’m probably going to blaze up as soon as I get home from work.

Myself? I can’t smoke herb like I used to, because I can’t afford to lose any motivation or productivity at this stage, no matter how little. I work ~50-55 hrs a week at my day job, 5-20 hours on nights and weekends doing IT consulting, depending on how busy I am, and use the remaining time available to me to work on building my career/business in the work I love- digital media. I’ve decided I want to make my living off of my creativity, because I enjoy that, and it’s tough to be successful in the design/media field, especially while holding down an unrelated day job. So smoking pot every day doesn’t work for me right now.
But I know loads of people who are trucking right along, high as hell, and if it’s not holding you back, then more power to ya.

-Tony Robbins :wink:

:tie:

80

*Originally posted by coreyem *
**I think we can agree that it is not possible to reach 100% of your maximum productivity level while smoking pot all day, like it or not. **

I disagree. How can you measure what is not available to be measured?

How can you say that I am not reaching 100% of my maximum productivity level, when you don’t know what my (or anyone else’s) productivity level can be? It is an unmeasureable tangent.

Also, who is to say that I wouldn’t be distracted by something else in life if I totally sober (like caffiene, or sugar, or some drug prescribed by a Dr.)?

Your statement is based on personal experience, not on any fact, since no studies of me have been done (except for that one by the FBI).

I’m not saying my lifestyle is best, or should even be considered for anyone else, but you can’t say I’m not fullfilling my potential, just because of something that happened to you.

I have worked 60 hours a week most of my life. Most of that time I did not smoke or drink at all, so I know what my potential production level is…

to that end, do you have 15 yrs experience as a sober worker? Do you have an additional 15 yrs as a “non-sober” worker? I think not… I do.

[size=1]Geez I hate preachy statements[/size]

Rev