Who would you vote for in November presedential elections?

talk random
121

ha, so to discuss things, you have to be in accord with the person you’re discussing with. How cute. How is supporting militant extremists inexcusable? Because the ones who do don’t think the same way you think? I’m not saying that supporting militant extremists is good, but I don’t see why you can’t understand that some people support them. They have the same views about the US, the same views about their fight, it’s not out of my scope of understanding that some people agree with the people fighting against the US army in Irak. I never said I supported them - though I don’t support the US army either. And I believe that they are fighting for their freedom, yes, they are trying to oust the US out of Iraq by any possible means. Hey, war’s ugly, you said so yourself, you can’t expect guerrilla fighters to come out in the open and challenge US tanks and missiles with RPGs and 1970’s AK-47 (well, I should say 1980’s AK47, they were donated to Iraq by the US at the end of the Iraq-Iran war).
Now you’ll have to explain how what the US are doing (btw, you should stop using the “we” form, it shows how objective you really are on this issue) is not oppressive. Sorry, but 150k soldiers on my land is enough for me to find it oppressive, so please tell me how this is not oppressive.

Please do not assume that your reading load is larger, that was very arrogant of you by the way lol - and I do read internationally.

Perhaps arrogant, maybe as arrogant as your saying I should read more (thus assuming I don’t read enough). So I’ll rephrase. I read way more than enough.

This all does boil down to you’re not American, and you don’t understand.
Sorry if that sounds bad, but refraining from other possibilities such as you support terrorism I would rather say that.

see? you’re only reading what you want to read. I never said I supported terrorism (and I thought we were talking about “insurgents” :wink: ) And yes, I’m not American, rightiooooooo. Are you telling me that WHATEVER I can say, it all comes down to “I don’t understand how Americans work, so I might as well hush up?”. It does sound badly patriotic and egocentric, though, you’re right on that. It’s no wonder most of the world was against this war in Iraq. We’re not Americans!! Lame argument.

And I hope that your view does not represent your country
I’m sure that, as you read international newspapers, you’ve heard of the 2 French journalists held hostage in Iraq, right? The dust they are lifting shows the views of my country. And no, of course I don’t represent my country, I would be ashamed not to think freely, but think according to what France says on those matters…

  • but then again it could only lend from the fact that your country has no military power and perhaps doesn’t understand the mechanics of war. Which you cannot be blamed nor held accountable for.
    oooooooook. whatever. lamest argument ever. What has this got to do with anything? And what gives you the idea that France has no military power, nor doesn’t understand the mechanics of warfare? LAME LAME LAME. It’s as if I was saying “your country has a history of roughly 300 years, you wouldn’t understand the mechanics of human relations on the long term”. LAME.
    Have you read Clausewitz’s “On War”? It’s an interesting essay.

ps: I’m happy I have opposite views from yours, really. I’ll go smoke my spliff now.

122

in the war for freedom - there are only two sides.

those trying to take it

and those trying to give it

in the war on terror - there are only two sides.

terrorists

and

those trying to stop them

you straddle the fence way too much for my liking Pomme - and yes I can hold that opinion and your word play leaves me laughing.

and there is a difference between understanding the premise(however wrong) that someone is acting on (terrorists and insurgents) and supporting and thinking what they are doing is right.

which one were you following again?

I know which one Bush follows, its the same one I follow :wink:

123

How about “I like grey better than black or white”? (straddling the fence, commonly known as the “objective observer point of view”)
How about you don’t put terrorists and insurgents in the same bag?
How about you give me the third option “the US are wrong, the terrorists are wrong too, but we’re in a mess way too deep to care now, let’s all slaughter each other”. Again, I have no solutions, but the solutions given by the USA are not good for me.

What word play? about insurgents and terrorists? No, you’re the one being amalgamous on that issue, I’m just correcting.

124

Freedom cannot be given, ever. It has to be taken, or it is not freedom…

in the war for freedom - there are only two sides.
those trying to take it
and those trying to give it

125

nicely said majaye.
freedom fighters are the heroes of the world
but in this case freedom fighters are neither the terrorists or the americans

126

only when talking about people capable of taking it themselves.

127

You’d have to agree, though, that a freedom that you’ve fought for is much more valuable than any freedom you can give.

128

this is true… which makes us even more proud of those Iraqi’s joining with us to protect and ensure a somewhat stable ground for their country…

but oh wait the “insurgents” kill them too…

129

But to be the devil’s advocate, the Insurgents can be fighting for Iraqi freedom too…

130

*slaps his forehead

<sigh>

lol

131

Thoughtful and provoking PR! :stuck_out_tongue:

I mean, in their minds they think so… and if you look at it through their eyes, it is a liberation war for them… (Even though I would be fighting against them, I understand their why they do it)

132

lol I concur-

while everyone has a right to think whatever they want…with that right comes the responsibility of those thoughts and actions.

if the insurgents want to think and act that way - which obviously according to free will principles they are able to, then they better be ready for the responsibilities and repercussions of those actions.

and yes people judge and rule over those actions - with laws, both national and international and according to what principles of right and wrong that are oddly enough inherent to most of us but dull as we are saturated with attitudes of “LIVE AS YOU PLEASE!”

133

Wow, all the choices are directed at either voting for Kerry or Bush. Otherwise, I guess we all just don’t vote, eh?

Bollox to ya, mate. I won’t vote for either of them (and I’m certainly not voting for Nader). Nice binary though.

134

I would like you to watch this

http://www.elcerebro.com/archivo/bushbinladden.htm

135

After watching that, you’ve caused my synapses to fire and my brow to furrow. So I have to ask: “Why is there a little, balding Asian man in that movie?”

Although nice try with the Triumph des Willens-like call to arms, but the differences between Bush and Kerry are (for me atleast) so minute, that you might as well be trumpeting the Kerry vote with the slogan: “He’s not Bush.” And as intriguing as some people might find that, there are 6.5 billion people in the world who fall under the same category.

If anything, you’d be better off trying to convince people who aren’t voting; as they still constitute a depressingly large segment of the American population.

136

the asian man is just a symbol. I agree with you, everything but bush is a reason someone would vote for kerry, I know the two are not the best presidents on the world but, If bush wins he will not care to be reelected this time and he will do whatever he wants… you know what that means for a man who wants to free the world

137

a balding asian man??? where do you get that from?? the white guy dressed in red white and blue, with the arrow pointing to him that says USA is somehow an asian??

Does this asian have ‘dots’ for eyebrows, or do you think perhaps that the dots are pupils, and the lines drawn under the eyes are creases??

If anything, you’d be better off trying to convince people who aren’t voting; as they still constitute a depressingly large segment of the American population.

so true… Our time would be better spent helping to inform those who would otherwise not participate…

138

[ot]It’s 'cause he’s short, isn’t it?

Seriously, I thought he was American… doesn’t look remotely Asian to me.[/ot]

139

I am a US citizen and will be voting for Bush.

I have heard/read that foreign (esp European) media has an even greater anti-Bush bias than the American media. I was talking with some exchange students at a local college (including a student from Kuwait, where, incidentally, the majorty of people think the US is doing the right thing in Iraq), who said that if all one takes into account is their countries media outlets, one would think that 99% (or some large percentage) of Americans dissagree with Bush.

If this is the case, it could contribute to the negative opinions about Bush around the world.

I am not trying to state any of this as fact, just opinions of what I have heard or read. Anyone care to comment?

PS. Thanks to those (most) of you who keep the political conversations civil here on kirupa, as opposed to the lunatics on IMDB :beer:

140

What’s IMDB ?

Foreign countries more firmly believe in the UN hence the hatred for bush. People realize that American policy affects the world, not just the USA and seeing what Bush has done, and plans to do, it develops a lot of hatred against Walker…

Don’t get foreigners wrong though, hating bush has nothing to do with hating america, au contraire…